wrong ovary
I would like to say that my daughter recently had the wrong ovary removed by a doctor in Columbus, Ohio. She had an ovary that this doctor was keeping an eye on through ultrsounds for a couple of years. She elected to removed it surgically and told my daughter that she would be fine and it would not change her in any way hormonally because she would still have her other healthy ovary. My daughter is 35 yrs old and had her tubes tied 2 years ago. The morning of surgery my daughter had a fear that they would remove the wrong ovary so she made sure that the doctor went over her chart and all the checks were in order before they took her back. About 45 minutes later my husband and I were called to a meeting room and told that the doctor would like to speak with us. I thought she finished the procedure rapidly but instead we were met with a very pale, shaky and tearful doctor. Fearing that she was going to say my daughter had cancer, I was relieved to find that she had removed the wrong ovary and that now she wanted to operate more and do an emergency hysterechtomy on my daughter. We were very upset to say the least. After thinking a few moments we decided that we did not want this doctor to operate further and we felt that this was something that our daughter needed to prepare herself for. The doctor and the representives of the hospital claimed full responsibility and were going to do a full investigation. They were very distraught. Now my daughter is left with the choice of keep the suspect ovary and go on keeping an eye on it for the rest of her life or have a very risky surgery on an ovay that is fused to her uterine wall. My question is this...Who takes responsibility for this? Is she owed any punitive damages, if so how much? How do you figure this stuff out? We have never sued anyone and really think that this could be one of those times when negligence is admitted. What to do...
Imalert wrote: Harley I'm
Harley
I'm wise to your "lifting" text from one thread
and interjecting it into another
Oh geez...no foolin' you I reckon...
As a physician - shame ! you just demonstrated the very
point I made on my NEW thread
As a patient..portending to claim some moral superiorityof a higher standard....double shame on your for not recognizing the rebuttal to you statements...LOL
harleyman "LOL whoopsy
harleyman
"LOL
whoopsy daisy!!! all fixed....No harm no foul....don't sue me!"
Ok so when YOU make a mistake and misquote Rockygirl - AND inject my quote UNRELATED quote here it's supposed to be funny??
Thank God you aren't a surgeon!
harleyman-4 wrote: Imalert
Harley
I'm wise to your "lifting" text from one thread
and interjecting it into another
Oh geez...no foolin' you I reckon...
As a physician - shame ! you just demonstrated the very
point I made on my NEW thread
As a patient..portending to claim some moral superiorityof a higher standard....double shame on your for not recognizing the rebuttal to you statements...LOL
What are you drinking??????????????
Imalert wrote: harleyman
harleyman
"LOL
whoopsy daisy!!! all fixed....No harm no foul....don't sue me!"
Ok so when YOU make a mistake and misquote Rockygirl - AND inject my quote UNRELATED quote here it's supposed to be funny??
Thank God you aren't a surgeon!
With your lack of deductive capacity...THANK GOD you're not providing legal representation to anyone...Stick to the forums here where you're relatively harmless!
It's a mistake, easily corrected....M-I-S-T-A-K-E......
no harm...no foul...
harleyman-4 wrote: It's a
It's a mistake, easily corrected....M-I-S-T-A-K-E......
no harm...no foul...
Typical doctor thinking. Hmffffff
nanny6087 wrote: They may
They may have admitted they made a mistake...but where does that leave you?
My daughter is now in limbo as far as her health is concerned because her 2nd opinion told her that the doctor that made the mistake is one of the best doctors he knows. We are afraid of his opinion.
Our understanding is this, if she does nothing and just keeps an eye on this ovary, the same as she has been doing for past few years, then she is not entitled to any punitive damages.
The 2nd opinion (Gyno-oncologist) friend to first doc says no to hysterectomy, says she should never had had the first surgery. Daughter says if she is such a great doctor then why would she do an unnescesary surgery, he says well not all doctors are alike in their thinking. Daughter says she may be the best doctor you know but she sure made a huge mistake on me.
Now I ask you, how would you trust this guys opinion? They are in same network and probably have been coached on what saves the doctor the most money.
In cahoots?
Right now, we want to know does she or doesn't she have the other surgery? Will the hospital and doctor pay for the other surgery if it is performed at a different hospital? We have not one desire to go back to that place.
Who keeps an eye on this if she opts out of surgery and who pays for it? Who pays for the babysitter when she has to go? Gas? Time out of work?
These same questions are for her if she has surgery.
I am telling you, I know this is not as bad as some people go through so we are thankful for that but this is a p in the a!!
nanny these are valid concerns - I would think it is
in your daughter's best interest to speak with her insurance company -
Perhaps they will agree that she had unnecessary surgery - They should cover any subsequent care
required by a specialist-
And for compensation - they just might duke it out with the hospital.
Even though the dr feels "terrible" it doesn't resolve
the medical issue at hand. This is clearly a dilemma for
your daughter.
Medical assitance for further care should be addressed by the attorney also.
An attorney can write demands for compensating treatment
I would think.
[By the way - don't let all the "side bar" comments such as harley's inappropriate comparison of posts bother you.
We're used to him - but you more than likely aren't]
heartthrob
It's a mistake, easily corrected....M-I-S-T-A-K-E......
no harm...no foul...
Typical doctor thinking. Hmffffff
HAHAH!!!! A typing error!
should my license be pulled?
Censured?
Perhaps a 1000 word paper on accuracy....
Perhaps you'd care to comment on the 5 or so quotes I "lifted" in reference to the remorseful, apologetic, embarrassed doctor..Since it's all so meaningless to you..Why should any medical professional even say it...
addendum to previous post...thank god you're not representative of a judge/jury....
Nanny6087
don't let Imalert's sidebars deceive you...She's paranoid and jaded.....We're all use to her rants here but you're probably not 
You've detailed quite appropriately how remorseful the doctor and administration were. Those admissions can't be taken back...Your attorney will likely help you come to a proper conclusion.
harleyman-4 wrote: qwackers
It will never make sense. And a very good reason why the medical doctors do not
publicize their own gripe forum.
Are you talking about on this website? LOL, anytime there's been a "doctor's forum" it's been swamped with responses by everyone but doctors.... Othe the other hand
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=257985
there's a mess of sites just like this. We know how to vent our frustrations as well.
Othe the other hand
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=257985
there's a mess of sites just like this. We know how to vent our frustrations as well.
ahhhh
Seems like Harley may be a "student" dr????
Yuk - that site delights in using the ER patients for comic relief-
And - they will soon be in the REAL world of medicine?
That is scary ---
Imalert wrote: harleyman-4
It will never make sense.
ahhhh
Seems like Harley may be a "student" dr????
Yuk - that site delights in using the ER patients for comic relief-
And - they will soon be in the REAL world of medicine?
That is scary ---
silly child 
...pulled it earlier;
Submitted by blake2go on Fri, 10/30/2009 - 19:47.
http://www.ratemds.com/social/?q=node/39687
Yes we do laugh...if you can't see the comic product, sad and pathetic though it may be...in a bottle shoved up the rectum......unless of course...you're one of "them".... 
Imalert wrote: ahhhh Seems
ahhhh
Seems like Harley may be a "student" dr????
Yuk - that site delights in using the ER patients for comic relief-
And - they will soon be in the REAL world of medicine?
That is scary ---
Indeed!!
Dear Jane emailed me this subject:
hopkins deja vu... http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5439851
note the resident doesn't tell the patient he is a resident (that we see)
The words sad and pathetic
The words sad and pathetic applied to human beings by human beings who are supposed to be healers. When we cannot show compassion to one another, extinction may be our only hope.
No, we do not all laugh. Well, perhaps we might at those who call others sad and pathetic.
heartthrob wrote: Dear Jane
Dear Jane emailed me this subject:
hopkins deja vu... http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5439851
note the resident doesn't tell the patient he is a resident (that we see)
Does a resident need to identify himself as such? He is a doctor, not a student.
I can't remember.
In this situation the doctor;
performed the procedure
make an error.
acknowledged the error
apologized
worked quickly to minimize the damage and seek correction.
Is the patient upset. Sure. Could the attending have made the same error. Of course. Teaching hospital. Got to learn somewhere otherwise future generations will have no proper medical care...
harleyman-4
Dear Jane emailed me this subject:
hopkins deja vu... http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=5439851
note the resident doesn't tell the patient he is a resident (that we see)
Does a resident need to identify himself as such? He is a doctor, not a student.
I can't remember.
In this situation the doctor;
performed the procedure
make an error.
acknowledged the error
apologized
worked quickly to minimize the damage and seek correction.
Is the patient upset. Sure. Could the attending have made the same error. Of course. Teaching hospital. Got to learn somewhere otherwise future generations will have no proper medical care...
He should have told the patient that he was an intern:
in·tern also in·terne (ntûrn)
n.
1.
a. A student or a recent graduate undergoing supervised practical training.
b. A physician who has recently graduated from medical school and is learning medical practice in a hospital under supervision, prior to beginning a residency program.
He does not tell the patient that he is an intern!!
Then what does this industrious fellow do? Sees bubbles and goes back for more!! Lets make sure we cause a 100% Pnuemo!! Then call the boss!!
heartthrob wrote: He should
He should have told the patient that he was an intern:
I honestly don't remember that rule. Did you just make it up, or is that a suggestion?
Nanny, I worked at an
Nanny, I worked at an Adventist hospital that had written in their employee handbook that staff physicians were not to 'speak out' against a colleague, and such offense would be punishable by loss of staff privileges.
Your second opinion is not going to say anything derogatory about doc #1.
You need further legal counseling. It does not seem fair nor logical that any legal pursuits should be dependent on you daughter undergoing further unnecessary procedures!! That's outrageous.
harleyman-4 wrote: qwackers
It will never make sense. And a very good reason why the medical doctors do not
publicize their own gripe forum.
Are you talking about on this website? LOL, anytime there's been a "doctor's forum" it's been swamped with responses by everyone but doctors.... Othe the other hand
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=257985
there's a mess of sites just like this. We know how to vent our frustrations as well.
Not referring to this website. There are many other places. If you like I can ask my brother-in-law, who is a physician, for you.
It is a shame the only website you know is for the low life students. Albeit, that website can be funny.
heartthrob wrote: Nanny, I
Nanny, I worked at an Adventist hospital that had written in their employee handbook that staff physicians were not to 'speak out' against a colleague, and such offense would be punishable by loss of staff privileges.
Your second opinion is not going to say anything derogatory about doc #1.
You need further legal counseling. It does not seem fair nor logical that any legal pursuits should be dependent on you daughter undergoing further unnecessary procedures!! That's outrageous.
I will second this opinion. Before you proceed any farther, I would consult with an attorney. Things that you say innocently
may come back to haunt you. They have made you an OFFER, to cover the cost of that surgery and any other surgeries she
made need. If you accept, it may take any other recourses you have away from you, ie-your right to sue for malpractice.
The OFFER is made through their attorneys even though you maybe talking to admin staff or the physicians. I have been
through this.
qwackers wrote: Not
Not referring to this website. There are many other places. If you like I can ask my brother-in-law, who is a physician, for you.
It is a shame the only website you know is for the low life students. Albeit, that website can be funny.
It's not Quakers. I just grabbed the link from th e other forum for convenience
Submitted by blake2go on Fri, 10/30/2009 - 19:47.
http://www.ratemds.com/social/?q=node/39687
harleyman-4 wrote: qwackers
Not referring to this website. There are many other places. If you like I can ask my brother-in-law, who is a physician, for you.
It is a shame the only website you know is for the low life students. Albeit, that website can be funny.
It's not Quakers. I just grabbed the link from th e other forum for convenience
Submitted by blake2go on Fri, 10/30/2009 - 19:47.
http://www.ratemds.com/social/?q=node/39687
Whew! Glad to hear that. You seem web savvy.
harleyman-4
"We call that 'the good old boys club".
"Any concern for the patient/victim is immediately out the window as soon as the error is made".
....Rocky; are you posting on the right forum?
Harley,
This is not my quote. I think it may be Pam's.
I see that has already been pointed out. Sorry, folks.
OMG You all have
OMG
You all have flipped...lol
What are you fighting about? I lost you at hello.
I will let you know how this progresses or what the outcome is.
Peace ~~~~~~~~~
nanny6087 wrote: OMG You all
OMG
You all have flipped...lol
What are you fighting about? I lost you at hello.
I will let you know how this progresses or what the outcome is.
Peace ~~~~~~~~~
snap back to reality.
Have a good night
Twain wrote: nanny6087: I'm
nanny6087: I'm sorry to hear about your daughter's misfortune. I hope things work out for her.
This week a second year resident in the McGill Medical School system killed herself after having committed a mistake. I don't know the details at this time (whether the patient was permanently disabled or died).
That is heartbreaking!
In my opinion, mistakes will happen, and there needs to be mandatory education and support services/counselling available for serious mistakes.
nanny6087 wrote: They may
They may have admitted they made a mistake...but where does that leave you?
Even though the dr feels "terrible" it doesn't resolve
the medical issue at hand. This is clearly a dilemma for
your daughter.
Medical assitance for further care should be addressed by the attorney also.
An attorney can write demands for compensating treatment
I would think.
It leaves you in a state of limbo, and not knowing what is the best thing to do based on today's best evidence.
It would nice if the doctor's could have the guts to have an open and honest discussion when a mistake happens, and invite the patient to watch a taped "education" session, so that the patient and family can hear the best evidence and know how terrible the doctor feels, and know that steps are being taken to ensure that this will not happen again.
I know, 
- I live in a dream world - I said it would be "nice".
The healthcare system says that they value patient safety, but the reality is that reputations and money come before ensuring that the best is done for the patient, and the patient is left in extreme distress and confusion. Medical experts and lawyers benefit from medical errors; patients, doctors and nurses do not.
wishandaprayer wrote: Twain
nanny6087: I'm sorry to hear about your daughter's misfortune. I hope things work out for her.
This week a second year resident in the McGill Medical School system killed herself after having committed a mistake. I don't know the details at this time (whether the patient was permanently disabled or died).
That is heartbreaking!
In my opinion, mistakes will happen, and there needs to be mandatory education and support services/counselling available for serious mistakes.
AMEN!
Nanny,
What has your lawyer said?
Have they met with the hospital?
Other than the surgery, and follow up is all they offer?
I still stand by what I've said previously, either you or your lawyer need to raise some dust.
The press, the web, taking it to the streets, make for one formidable weapon.
heartthrob wrote: He should
He should have told the patient that he was an intern:
in·tern also in·terne (ntûrn)
n.
1.
a. A student or a recent graduate undergoing supervised practical training.
b. A physician who has recently graduated from medical school and is learning medical practice in a hospital under supervision, prior to beginning a residency program.
He does not tell the patient that he is an intern!!
Just a little kicker; "Supervised" does not mean same room/eyes on.
same building/phone accessible, yes.
Heatthrob, as a nurse who has worked in a hospital setting are you honestly saying you've not observed interns working independent (different room) of an attending?
"He does not tell the patient that he is an intern....-that we see"...exactly. So you're assuming.
In this situation, the Intern was acting accordingly.
harleyman-4
He should have told the patient that he was an intern:
in·tern also in·terne (ntûrn)
n.
1.
a. A student or a recent graduate undergoing supervised practical training.
b. A physician who has recently graduated from medical school and is learning medical practice in a hospital under supervision, prior to beginning a residency program.
He does not tell the patient that he is an intern!!
Just a little kicker; "Supervised" does not mean same room/eyes on.
same building/phone accessible, yes.
Heatthrob, as a nurse who has worked in a hospital setting are you honestly saying you've not observed interns working independent (different room) of an attending?
"He does not tell the patient that he is an intern....-that we see"...exactly. So you're assuming.
In this situation, the Intern was acting accordingly.
I do believe that the patient has the right to know who is doing what to her. If he is a resident, intern, fellow, he should say up front. If she wants someone else, she should have the right to say so.
It seemed to me that this cocky fellow needed direct supervision, since he went back in repeatedly, even though he was pulling air, which should have told him that he had already caused a pneumothorax.
This was Johns Hopkins, where they advocate trainees running around doing whatever they want unsupervised and even without informed consent. I know, they did it to me. I consented to Hugh Calkins performing a Pulmonary Vein Ablation on me, and after he had me anesthetized, he slipped in a fellow that I had never even met or seen. That fellow had NO CONSENT and almost killed me. http://adventuresincardiology.com/
I only hope that Johns Hopkins Hospital will one day learn that this is the 21st century and patients are not going to put up with that anymore. This is not the dark ages.
heartthrob
He should have told the patient that he was an intern:
in·tern also in·terne (ntûrn)
n.
1.
a. A student or a recent graduate undergoing supervised practical training.
b. A physician who has recently graduated from medical school and is learning medical practice in a hospital under supervision, prior to beginning a residency program.
He does not tell the patient that he is an intern!!
Just a little kicker; "Supervised" does not mean same room/eyes on.
same building/phone accessible, yes.
Heatthrob, as a nurse who has worked in a hospital setting are you honestly saying you've not observed interns working independent (different room) of an attending?
"He does not tell the patient that he is an intern....-that we see"...exactly. So you're assuming.
In this situation, the Intern was acting accordingly.
I do believe that the patient has the right to know who is doing what to her. If he is a resident, intern, fellow, he should say up front. If she wants someone else, she should have the right to say so.
It seemed to me that this cocky fellow needed direct supervision, since he went back in repeatedly, even though he was pulling air, which should have told him that he had already caused a pneumothorax.
This was Johns Hopkins, where they advocate trainees running around doing whatever they want unsupervised and even without informed consent. I know, they did it to me. I consented to Hugh Calkins performing a Pulmonary Vein Ablation on me, and after he had me anesthetized, he slipped in a fellow that I had never even met or seen. That fellow had NO CONSENT and almost killed me. http://adventuresincardiology.com/
I only hope that Johns Hopkins Hospital will one day learn that this is the 21st century and patients are not going to put up with that anymore. This is not the dark ages.
I'm getting off the topic, so I'll just add this and then be quiet. My pain clinic was also at a teaching hospital. The doctor or intern would make a brief appearance and disappear and then reappear. This could happen several times during a visit. It was like whisper down the alley. We all know how that game goes. I was in no shape for games. I would never recommend a teaching hospital when you have a serious problem going on.
Harleyman wrote: Heatthrob,
Heatthrob, as a nurse who has worked in a hospital setting are you honestly saying you've not observed interns working independent (different room) of an attending?
Oops, I did forget to address this. I never really worked in a teaching hospital.
heartthrob wrote: It seemed
It seemed to me that this cocky fellow needed direct supervision, since he went back in repeatedly, even though he was pulling air, which should have told him that he had already caused a pneumothorax.
cocky? really?....he doesn't come off that way in the video...Is he cocky during the apology part, or when he's explaining the procedure, or when he's talking to the camera about his mistake?
This was Johns Hopkins, where they advocate trainees running around doing whatever they want unsupervised and even without informed consent
A baseless comment to be ignored. I'll invite you to publish any literature, policy procedure manual, lecture notes....anything to back up this statement.
heartthrob wrote: Harleyman
Heatthrob, as a nurse who has worked in a hospital setting are you honestly saying you've not observed interns working independent (different room) of an attending?
Oops, I did forget to address this. I never really worked in a teaching hospital.
Well then how can you make any kind of qualified comment as a nurse if you've not been placed in to proper setting?
heartthrob wrote: It seemed
It seemed to me that this cocky fellow needed direct supervision, since he went back in repeatedly, even though he was pulling air, which should have told him that he had already caused a pneumothorax.
cocky? really?....he doesn't come off that way in the video...Is he cocky during the apology part, or when he's explaining the procedure, or when he's talking to the camera about his mistake?
In the beginning, getting on the elevator.
This was Johns Hopkins, where they advocate trainees running around doing whatever they want unsupervised and even without informed consent
A baseless comment to be ignored. I'll invite you to publish any literature, policy procedure manual, lecture notes....anything to back up this statement.
harleyman-4
Heatthrob, as a nurse who has worked in a hospital setting are you honestly saying you've not observed interns working independent (different room) of an attending?
Oops, I did forget to address this. I never really worked in a teaching hospital.
Well then how can you make any kind of qualified comment as a nurse if you've not been placed in to proper setting?
Where did I try to qualify my statements as a nurse? I was speaking purely from a patient standpoint. I think I have the right to know who is going to operate on me, don't you?
heartthrob
cocky? really?....he doesn't come off that way in the video...Is he cocky during the apology part, or when he's explaining the procedure, or when he's talking to the camera about his mistake?
In the beginning, getting on the elevator.
interesting interpretation....with all the papers in his hand...he looked busy IMHO.
Yes, I'm not interested in re-reading though the volumes of hearsay again...do you have any concrete evidence supporting your claim that JH advocates.....? Your individual case notwithstanding, you are attempting to implicate an entire facility, staff, community all at once.
I think my personal
I think my personal experience ought to be about as real as it gets, and I don't appreciate this very much:
"Yes, I'm not interested in re-reading though the volumes of hearsay again"
They almost killed me and then tried to lie their way out of it, with the help of defense attorneys that are paid by none other than Johns Hopkins Hospital. I haven't seen where anyone looks any worse off for what they did to me. They're still trying to lie about it. In fact they're trying to cook up fake documents and stick them in the chart, after all these years. Think I don't know it? I have that original chart memorized. I recognize a new fake document when I see one.
We're way OT, and this is making me upset. Especially your incorrigible, insulting responses. Goodbye Harley.
heartthrob wrote: I think my
I think my personal experience ought to be about as real as it gets, and I don't appreciate this very much:
"Yes, I'm not interested in re-reading though the volumes of hearsay again"
Harley is a joke. Anyone in their right mind should know this by now.
Harley, yes, John Hopkins is a very good hospital just like mine is. However, you need to look at cases as just that. Case-by-case. Hospitals do screw up and should be accountable.
heartthrob wrote: I think my
I think my personal experience ought to be about as real as it gets, .......... Especially your incorrigible, insulting responses. Goodbye Harley.
incorrigible...like you trying to implicate an entire medical community on the basis of your singular experience?
I'm not finding fault with your case Heartthrob, only the way you choose to degrade an entire facilty.
damagedgoods wrote: Harley,
Harley, yes, John Hopkins is a very good hospital just like mine is. However, you need to look at cases as just that. Case-by-case. Hospitals do screw up and should be accountable.
I agree, when they are proven guilty...absolutely.
harleyman-4
Harley, yes, John Hopkins is a very good hospital just like mine is. However, you need to look at cases as just that. Case-by-case. Hospitals do screw up and should be accountable.
I agree, when they are proven guilty...absolutely.
The problem for the patient is they have no one. I'm single. "We don't generally know the law". Nor do we have someone in the middle of the night to look out for us. I do think the advocates or liason are for the doctors. Like one doctor said to me, he's on my side but does not want to bring up a can of old worms.
harleyman-4 wrote: I'm not
I'm not finding fault with your case Heartthrob, only the way you choose to degrade an entire facilty.
Trainees should not be doing procedures on patients without their consent. Is that degrading entire facilities? Sheesh, how you put words in peoples mouths. Where do you come up with these things?
Do I personally think a lot of Hopkins? No!! Would I go back there? No!! That's just my personal opinion, based on my experience.
harleyman-4 wrote: ,,,,I'm
,,,,I'm not finding fault with your case Heartthrob, only the way you choose to degrade an entire facilty.
Well said!
heartthrob wrote: Trainees
Trainees should not be doing procedures on patients without their consent. Is that degrading entire facilities? Sheesh, how you put words in peoples mouths. Where do you come up with these things?
This was Johns Hopkins, where they advocate trainees running around doing whatever they want unsupervised and even without informed consent
your words, that's where I come up with these things. The english you use....you're implicating every single individual unassociated in any way with your particular case. LOL.
Zexaeq
http://www.ratemds.com/social/?q=node/39129#comment-168965
Your words on the Laughology thread: Unha vez unha cagada sempre unha cagada
Translation: Once a ****,{turd} always a ****! I know that describes me, but you? The king of the forum, the philanthropist, the poet, he who makes women swoon? I can't believe it! LOL
Med101 wrote: Zexaeq
http://www.ratemds.com/social/?q=node/39129#comment-168965
Your words on the Laughology thread: Unha vez unha cagada sempre unha cagada
Translation: Once a ****,{turd} always a ****! I know that describes me, but you? The king of the forum, the philanthropist, the poet, he who makes women swoon? I can't believe it! LOL
nanny, This sounds like an
nanny,
This sounds like an open and shut medical malpractice case. Also, if the remaining ovary doesn't have any cancerous growths, I don't know why it would need to be removed. And there certainly doesn't seem to be any reason to remove the uterus. Before your daughter even considers additional surgery for removal of the ovary and/or uterus, please go to www.hersfoundation.com and learn about the effects of uterus and/or ovary removal. These organs are vital to life-long health. The uterus is key to the pelvic structure. It's removal increases risk of incontinence and will cause the spine to compress and the hips to widen. Risk of heart disease will be 3 times that of an intact woman. The ovaries produce hormones throughout life. Their removal will increase risk of heart disease 7 times that of an intact woman and increase risk of all-cause mortality.
Good luck getting justice for the doctor's screw-up!
Thanks Mad as Hell She is
Thanks Mad as Hell
She is going to all that she can to keep her ovary and uterus. For sure!
You know this is one of those cases where life throws you a lemon and you either catch it and make lemonade or you bend over and pucker up
http://www.jointcommission.or
http://www.jointcommission.org/PatientSafety/UniversalProtocol/
Nanny
this is the UNIVERSAL protocol for pre-surgery that all hospitals must use and required by JCAHO [includes marking of surgical site]
It is quite specific - so it's hard to say that the dr
only found too late that the wrong ovary was taken
The regulations are SO strict -wondering if someone may have marked your daughter wrongly?
Is anyone else as annoyed as
Is anyone else as annoyed as I am with
zexaeq's persistent posts of HUGE images with not
much else to say???
Courteous consideration for the original
poster should be followed here-
Hogging a thread with this Looney Tune
stuff is bad manners.
At minimum
MINIMIZE the darn pictures!!!
Thanks for the link! They
Thanks for the link!
They absolutely did NOT mark her and she did speak out before the surgery reminding the doctor which ovary was to be removed. The doctor looked very tired, her hair was still damp, it was early in the morning.
She just saw an ovary and took it out, the first one she found. She did not look around for the other one until she was waiting for the pathology results. She made a big mistake, admitted it. I say just make it right.
I wonder if the doctor could
I wonder if the doctor could have covered up her mistake somehow. Could she have told your daughter that the diseased ovary was in fact removed, and when your daughter proceeded to have symptoms, advise her that now the remaining ovary was acting up?
I think that you need to be very grateful that the doctor was compassionate and caring, and admitted her mistake. The doctor is human; maybe she was very tired and maybe she had other overwhelming issues. I don't believe that the doctor should be shamed for her error; in doing so, "cover-ups" become an inviting option.
Perhaps options that are available now have pros and cons. The facts need to be laid out so that the best option is available, and your daughter needs to be able to make an informed choice. What needs to happen now is for the doctors to get beyond the mistake, and present the options in a very clear manner. It would good to have doctors, a lawyer and a patient advocate not affiliated with the hospital available to help your daughter choose the best option.
The hospital should cover any costs associated with whatever option your daughter chooses, and her decision should not be related to whether or not it makes a lawsuit more attractive to a lawyer.
I'm very sorry for what happened to your daughter, and I hope that she can find physical and emotional healing through competent handling of this unfortunate error.
nanny6087 wrote: Thanks for
Thanks for the link!
They absolutely did NOT mark her and she did speak out before the surgery reminding the doctor which ovary was to be removed. The doctor looked very tired, her hair was still damp, it was early in the morning.
She just saw an ovary and took it out, the first one she found. She did not look around for the other one until she was waiting for the pathology results. She made a big mistake, admitted it. I say just make it right.
Hmm.. if your daughter was not marked at all
then it appears the "mistake" began BEFORE incision
NOT after.
That slants the whole case with a different color~
I'm sure the attorney knows this???
The patient is supposed to witness the marking.
[I did - prior to being sedated the nurse asked if
I agreed if this was the correct side for surgery]
http://newsblog.projo.com/200
http://newsblog.projo.com/2009/11/rhode-island-hospital-fined-15.html
Breaking news today- Too many wrong site surgeries
There was mention of CAMERAS being
mandated in the future in OR to avoid this problem
The news report said this problem is rampant within this
particular institution-
Is this based mainly on the current generation of surgeons? I don't believe that in the past 20 years that this problem was so pervasive in the surgical field.
I got a call today that
I got a call today that there was something on the radio from CNN about surgical errors like this, wrong side, wrong organ etc. If you have a medical horror story to tell, email your story to CNN and they may read it on the air.
I have tried to find it at their site, and have not been able to find it. If anyone else comes up with it, or hears of it. Please post it for Nanny.
I am getting more worried by
I am getting more worried by the minute.
The attorney says the hospital claims no responsibility and he is agreeing with it.
We would like to go public with this and he says no...it might make the doctor mad and she won't settle if she is upset.
We are very confused, he says that their is not punitive damages if she does not get the hysterectomy. What if she needs one 2 years from now? And why does it matter. It is sort of like getting raped, you feel violated. So does that mean it is ok to rape as long as you don't impregnate.
I am mad!
Not sure where to turn next.
My daughter feels like she should just do whatever the attorney says.
The hospital will not give her a copy of the official investigation...BS
They say they don't have to.
nanny6087 wrote: I am
I am getting more worried by the minute.
The attorney says the hospital claims no responsibility and he is agreeing with it.
We would like to go public with this and he says no...it might make the doctor mad and she won't settle if she is upset.
We are very confused, he says that their is not punitive damages if she does not get the hysterectomy. What if she needs one 2 years from now? And why does it matter. It is sort of like getting raped, you feel violated. So does that mean it is ok to rape as long as you don't impregnate.
I am mad!
Not sure where to turn next.
My daughter feels like she should just do whatever the attorney says.
The hospital will not give her a copy of the official investigation...BS
They say they don't have to.
Nanny. Have you checked out RateMyLawyer.com? I'm not joking, nor am I using your case as a means to make others laugh. There is such a site. Check this guy out on their site, and if he doesn't show up, check up on how many cases,(like yours) he's tried. I'm not a lawyer, but it seems to me he's not very aggressive. Why get a Cocker Spaniel when you need a Pit Bull? I can see your daughter's point. She wants this over! Unfortunately, sometimes you have to hang in there and fight.
As far as the hospital is concerned, they feel the official investigation is their property. That could be the law where you live, but a good attorney might be able to get around that. Here's wishing you and your daughter luck.
PS Ask Mic, he'll probably give you much better advice than I.
nanny6087 wrote: I am
I am getting more worried by the minute.
The attorney says the hospital claims no responsibility and he is agreeing with it.
We would like to go public with this and he says no...it might make the doctor mad and she won't settle if she is upset.
We are very confused, he says that their is not punitive damages if she does not get the hysterectomy. What if she needs one 2 years from now? And why does it matter. It is sort of like getting raped, you feel violated. So does that mean it is ok to rape as long as you don't impregnate.
I am mad!
Not sure where to turn next.
My daughter feels like she should just do whatever the attorney says.
The hospital will not give her a copy of the official investigation...BS
They say they don't have to.
NANNY
"The attorney says the hospital claims no responsibility and he is agreeing with it."
Look up Respondent Superior - [liability of hospital for its employees - agents etc] There is case law to support hospital liability if good practices are not in place that proximately cause injury.
Your attorney is acting too weird...
Has your atty actually filed a complaint YET??
If not he can NOT predict what a potential defendant will do
I'm sorry to say - that he is acting like he's siding with the hospital - I hope you haven't given him alot of $$$ ???
"The hospital will not give her a copy of the official investigation...BS"
[edited]
That is for a court to decide - and if a court agrees, it can be subpoenaed or requested "in camera" for admission if it is considered privilege work product-
I am not an atty so please don't misconstrue this as legal advice ok???
Please see my PM to you...........
Wow! I am sorry to hear of
Wow! I am sorry to hear of your and your daughters troubles.
This has raised some questions.
we were met with a very pale, shaky and tearful doctor. Fearing that she was going to say my daughter had cancer, I was relieved to find that she had removed the wrong ovary and that now she wanted to operate more and do an emergency hysterectomy on my daughter.
How was it she had a doctor who unable to tell left from right?
How is it when the wrong ovary was exposed and seen not to be fused to anything, why was it removed?
Was the purpose of the emergency hysterectomy, just a way for them tunneling across to the other ovary, without a second incision?
A sharpie marker is a surgery patients best friend.
I had a hernia repaired, I also had a disinterested surgeon, I was not shaved prior to being taken to the OR.
I used my sharpie, to write "hernia here" with an arrow >>>>>>>
As to having the other surgery, I don't understand how it could be very risky, any more than it would have been, if they had got it right the first time.
I wish you both the best!
Her explanation was this....
Her explanation was this.... I have no excuses, I made a mistake.
It was done through the scope, she was waiting for the pathology tests to come back and decided to look around and see how the other ovary looked and she immediately new she had removed the wrong one. The bad one was all bumpy and the good one, well it looked good...we have the pictures of the ovaries. We did not know that the bad ovary was fused, supposedly that could not be seen on the ultrasounds. So she went from having a pretty easy surgery, removing one bumpy ovary to have a full hysterectomy.
My daughter saw another specialist and he said that he would leave it the way it is, in fact he would not have done any surgery. He is an oncologist, he said that cutting through a fused ovary is riskier than the risk of cancer.
They did all the checks before the operating room but admittingly the system failed in the operating room.
What now?
Well I'm no doc, but if it
Well I'm no doc, but if it looks bad to me, then it has got to go.
The biggest risk seems to be anesthesia, and she has survived it once.
This is part one of 4
First take a deep
First take a deep breath......this is a terrible
situation for all concerned
The dr truly feels horrible but your daughter has
been severely damaged.
The first step is to get ALL the medical records
right down to WHO was in the OR and all
treatment records.
She will need them for further treatment anyway
so she needs to start a log of events and
file folders for all the records.
The dr. has medmal insurance so don't worry about
that .. concentrate on getting things right for
your daughter.
Since you have a minimum of one year statute of limitation [don't know your state rules] you have plenty of time - so don't panic.
It's important that your daughter recovers and gets
excellent medical advice right now.
When all the dust settles [after getting all the records]then you could scour the internet - read up on some
law firms - and then maybe call a few lawyers who deal in medical malpractice.
Keep good track of each lawyer because they do know each
other - and there are some pitfalls in a situation
like this.
Check their bar# where they practice- that's easy
just use their name and go the the state bar assoc. to see if they are in good standing.
Make sure you ask it they deal with this type of issue
It's called "unnecessary surgery" much like wrong leg litigation
In speaking with lawyers, I wouldn't mention the dr name but you could ask if they have any conflict of interest in suing the institution
Ask for a free consultation and don't let anyone
manipulate your daughter into a huge retainer etc
I believe she can find one on contingency since it
is air tight that it was the wrong body part
Come back here often - there are some very good minds
here [attached to the people hahaha] and they are
very helpful
This is just the beginning of a journey you are yet
familiar with - but the legal stuff can wait a bit
while everyone has a chance to think
For all you know the hosp or dr may offer to settle
immediately- but you would still need legal advice~
Wishing you and your daughter some peace in the meantime
Thank you I had a feeling
Thank you
I had a feeling that I would get some sound advice on here.
It seems that the doctors and the health network they are in are all sticking together. We are frightened that they don't have her best interest at heart.
We actually have an attorney now and he is a malpractice attorney but has never had a "wrong ovary" case.
So far the "people" are pushing for her to have the hysterectomy.
Is the hospital liable? They claimed full responsibility when it happened and said my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment.
"my daughter would owe
"my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment".
Well that's big of them...
I don't know what your lawyer is costing you, or is it a contingency?
I'd bet the hospital would love to settle this out of court, did you talk to them at length before getting the lawyer?
Had it been me, with my lawyer allergy, I'd have said 1.5 mil and we forget about this, let them make a counter offer, and if it is not a happy number, I'd leave with a "see you in court" and go home and wait for the phone call.
More than the money, is the fear of the press, every hospital administrator has to live in dread, of the press conference held by a patient who has suffered incompetence.
Blake is right about the
Blake is right about the sharpies. When I had surgery last year on my elbow, three or four people confirmed with my that it was the left elbow. Then, my surgeon had to come over and write with the sharpie on my arm to confirm before I was taken into the OR. Nothing was left to chance. Why didn't they do this for your daughter, do you know?
nanny6087 wrote: Thank you I
Thank you
I had a feeling that I would get some sound advice on here.
It seems that the doctors and the health network they are in are all sticking together.
We call that 'the good old boys club'.
We are frightened that they don't have her best interest at heart.
Count on it!! They only have their best interest at heart. Any concern for the patient/victim is immediately out the window as soon as the error is made. They're off with their 'risk managers' trying to figure a way out.
So far the "people" are pushing for her to have the hysterectomy.
Why in the world would that be? I thought she had a 'lumpy ovary'?? Why would that require a hysterectomy? Who are these 'people'? As to the remaining ovary that is adhered to the abdominal wall, if it is not causing a problem and not cancerous, I hear more horror stories about people developing very painful adhesions from surgeries like that. I would really think about the necessity of that.
Is the hospital liable? They claimed full responsibility when it happened and said my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment.
I don't know about you, but if it were me, and someone goofed like that, I would never go back and give them a second chance. Not when you're talking about your life!! Good luck Nanny!!
rockygirl wrote: Blake is
Blake is right about the sharpies. When I had surgery last year on my elbow, three or four people confirmed with my that it was the left elbow. Then, my surgeon had to come over and write with the sharpie on my arm to confirm before I was taken into the OR. Nothing was left to chance. Why didn't they do this for your daughter, do you know?
They do the same for eye surgery - at least in Toronto.
wishandaprayer
Blake is right about the sharpies. When I had surgery last year on my elbow, three or four people confirmed with my that it was the left elbow. Then, my surgeon had to come over and write with the sharpie on my arm to confirm before I was taken into the OR. Nothing was left to chance. Why didn't they do this for your daughter, do you know?
They do the same for eye surgery - at least in Toronto.
Seems like that would make the surgeon feel really dumb, as well they should.
heartthrob
Blake is right about the sharpies. When I had surgery last year on my elbow, three or four people confirmed with my that it was the left elbow. Then, my surgeon had to come over and write with the sharpie on my arm to confirm before I was taken into the OR. Nothing was left to chance. Why didn't they do this for your daughter, do you know?
They do the same for eye surgery - at least in Toronto.
Seems like that would make the surgeon feel really dumb, as well they should.
They are being very careful so that there is no miscommunication or human brainfart. Can you imagine if they operated on my wong eye? I would be in a complete mess.
I appreciate all of the
I appreciate all of the comments.
The "people" that I was referring to is the doctors insurance company.
I guess they say that if she doesn't have another surgery then her blotched surgery was not life altering??
Maybe not from the outside looking in...what a big mess. So what if she gets the hysterectomy in 2 years after something changes?
you go in to surgery thinking you know what you are getting into, doctor makes a big mistake, takes out the wrong organ and the only way they want to compensate you for it is if you take all your junk out. That makes them happy! Then you deserve something.
What next. Should she file a complaint with the state medical board?
Should she call the media? Would you like to use a hospital or a doctor that was involved in this and then they don't want to compensate you for your loss?
By the way, they did not
By the way, they did not mark her anywhere.
nanny this site may be
nanny
this site may be helpful - the universal protocol for wrong site surgery
http://www.jointcommission.org/PatientSafety/UniversalProtocol/
On one hand; nanny6087
On one hand;
.......told that the doctor would like to speak with us. I thought she finished the procedure rapidly but instead we were met with a very pale, shaky and tearful doctor.
....The doctor and the representives of the hospital claimed full responsibility and were going to do a full investigation. They were very distraught.....
....Her explanation was this.... I have no excuses, I made a mistake.
.....They claimed full responsibility when it happened and said my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment.......
....The "people" that I was referring to is the doctors insurance company.
And then we have this;
"We call that 'the good old boys club".
"Any concern for the patient/victim is immediately out the window as soon as the error is made".
....Rocky; are you posting on the right forum?
that once a patient is injured the medical community "circles the wagons" to conceal any wrongdoing by a colleauge.
....this "good ol boys" mentality must
come to an end!
I lifted this from today's new forum. Alert must not have had time to read this one.
I remember not so long ago, on these forums that half the problem was doctors/hospitals not admitting an error, not saying I made a mistake........Apparently even when they do, the pitchforks appear. Circle the wagons....Yup, due to fickle statements and beliefs such as these.
harleyman-4 wrote: On one
On one hand;
.......told that the doctor would like to speak with us. I thought she finished the procedure rapidly but instead we were met with a very pale, shaky and tearful doctor.
....The doctor and the representives of the hospital claimed full responsibility and were going to do a full investigation. They were very distraught.....
....Her explanation was this.... I have no excuses, I made a mistake.
.....They claimed full responsibility when it happened and said my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment.......
....The "people" that I was referring to is the doctors insurance company.
And then we have this;
"We call that 'the good old boys club".
"Any concern for the patient/victim is immediately out the window as soon as the error is made".
....Rocky; are you posting on the right forum?
that once a patient is injured the medical community "circles the wagons" to conceal any wrongdoing by a colleauge.
....this "good ol boys" mentality must
come to an end!
I lifted this from today's new forum. Alert must not have had time to read this one.
I remember not so long ago, on these forums that half the problem was doctors/hospitals not admitting an error, not saying I made a mistake........Apparently even when they do, the pitchforks appear. Circle the wagons....Yup, due to fickle statements and beliefs such as these.
I believe that is the reason why this is a forum for patients. Anyone who claims to be a physician on this site and joins the
discussions does so at their own sanity. It will never make sense. And a very good reason why the medical doctors do not
publicize their own gripe forum. Smile, Harley, they are only words.
I am truly sorry for this young woman and the outcome of her surgery. I do know a very good and well known malpractice attorney.
If her family is interested in the name, they may PM me.
qwackers wrote: It will
It will never make sense. And a very good reason why the medical doctors do not
publicize their own gripe forum.
Are you talking about on this website? LOL, anytime there's been a "doctor's forum" it's been swamped with responses by everyone but doctors.... Othe the other hand
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=257985
there's a mess of sites just like this. We know how to vent our frustrations as well.
nanny6087: I'm sorry to hear
nanny6087: I'm sorry to hear about your daughter's misfortune. I hope things work out for her.
This week a second year resident in the McGill Medical School system killed herself after having committed a mistake. I don't know the details at this time (whether the patient was permanently disabled or died).
harleyman-4 wrote: On one
On one hand;
.......told that the doctor would like to speak with us. I thought she finished the procedure rapidly but instead we were met with a very pale, shaky and tearful doctor.
....The doctor and the representives of the hospital claimed full responsibility and were going to do a full investigation. They were very distraught.....
....Her explanation was this.... I have no excuses, I made a mistake.
.....They claimed full responsibility when it happened and said my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment.......
....The "people" that I was referring to is the doctors insurance company.
And then we have this;
"We call that 'the good old boys club".
"Any concern for the patient/victim is immediately out the window as soon as the error is made".
....Rocky; are you posting on the right forum?
that once a patient is injured the medical community "circles the wagons" to conceal any wrongdoing by a colleauge.
....this "good ol boys" mentality must
come to an end!
I lifted this from today's new forum. Alert must not have had time to read this one.
I remember not so long ago, on these forums that half the problem was doctors/hospitals not admitting an error, not saying I made a mistake........Apparently even when they do, the pitchforks appear. Circle the wagons....Yup, due to fickle statements and beliefs such as these.
Harley, I wouldn't have bothered to reply to this poster if I couldn't speak from personal experience.
It appears that you can't even get your quotes straight.(sorry Rockygirl) It's a good thing you're not a surgeon!!!
"I lifted this from today's
"I lifted this from today's new forum. Alert must not have had time to read this one."
Harley
I'm wise to your "lifting" text from one thread
and interjecting it into another [even though
the subject matter is different]
As a physician - shame ! you just demonstrated the very
point I made on my NEW thread -
Since you're acting like a "good ol boy" why don't
you go stuff yourself in a "wagon" and go round in circles.....until you make sense.
I won't hold my breath though~
They may have admitted they
They may have admitted they made a mistake...but where does that leave you?
My daughter is now in limbo as far as her health is concerned because her 2nd opinion told her that the doctor that made the mistake is one of the best doctors he knows. We are afraid of his opinion.
Our understanding is this, if she does nothing and just keeps an eye on this ovary, the same as she has been doing for past few years, then she is not entitled to any punitive damages.
The 2nd opinion (Gyno-oncologist) friend to first doc says no to hysterectomy, says she should never had had the first surgery. Daughter says if she is such a great doctor then why would she do an unnescesary surgery, he says well not all doctors are alike in their thinking. Daughter says she may be the best doctor you know but she sure made a huge mistake on me.
Now I ask you, how would you trust this guys opinion? They are in same network and probably have been coached on what saves the doctor the most money.
In cahoots?
Right now, we want to know does she or doesn't she have the other surgery? Will the hospital and doctor pay for the other surgery if it is performed at a different hospital? We have not one desire to go back to that place.
Who keeps an eye on this if she opts out of surgery and who pays for it? Who pays for the babysitter when she has to go? Gas? Time out of work?
These same questions are for her if she has surgery.
I am telling you, I know this is not as bad as some people go through so we are thankful for that but this is a p in the a!!
On one hand; nanny6087
On one hand;
.......told that the doctor would like to speak with us. I thought she finished the procedure rapidly but instead we were met with a very pale, shaky and tearful doctor.
....The doctor and the representives of the hospital claimed full responsibility and were going to do a full investigation. They were very distraught.....
....Her explanation was this.... I have no excuses, I made a mistake.
.....They claimed full responsibility when it happened and said my daughter would owe nothing and that she would not have to pay for any follow-up treatment.......
....The "people" that I was referring to is the doctors insurance company.
And then we have this;
"We call that 'the good old boys club".
"Any concern for the patient/victim is immediately out the window as soon as the error is made".
....Heartthrob; are you posting on the right forum?
that once a patient is injured the medical community "circles the wagons" to conceal any wrongdoing by a colleauge.
....this "good ol boys" mentality must
come to an end!
I lifted this from today's new forum. Alert must not have had time to read this one.
I remember not so long ago, on these forums that half the problem was doctors/hospitals not admitting an error, not saying I made a mistake........Apparently even when they do, the pitchforks appear. Circle the wagons....Yup, due to fickle statements and beliefs such as these.
LOL
whoopsy daisy!!! all fixed....No harm no foul....don't sue me!